Outreach across the marshes - Revision history

Rafferty: /* Further Reading */

2026-08-27T16:23:32Z

GuiltyConscience: /* Bunds */

2026-08-27T14:06:14Z

Bunds

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:06, 27 August 2026
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	Of course if they were members of the Empire, the land would not be a problem - but it would create a very different issue. If the Sand Fishers join the Empire, most folk would expect them to join the League. It's certainly what many of them imagine may eventually happen to the younger members of the sept. But if they join the League, they'll become League citizens, they'll form a magical bond with the League egregore. They'll dress a little bit more like League citizens, they'll think more like other League citizens, they'll act more like any other League citizen would.		Of course if they were members of the Empire, the land would not be a problem - but it would create a very different issue. If the Sand Fishers join the Empire, most folk would expect them to join the League. It's certainly what many of them imagine may eventually happen to the younger members of the sept. But if they join the League, they'll become League citizens, they'll form a magical bond with the League egregore. They'll dress a little bit more like League citizens, they'll think more like other League citizens, they'll act more like any other League citizen would.

	And that's a problem, because as Three Hands has repeatedly pointed out, there are precious few people in Holberg who want to live miles from the city, farming for a living. Most of the population of the territory is concentrated in the city, and moving to the city is the kind of dream that animates anyone with imagination and drive who doesn't already live there. Many older Sand Fishers still find the bustling streets of Holberg intimidating, but the younger members of the sept certainly don't. If the Sand Fishers become League citizens, why would they settle for farming lands in ~~Rabeshof~~ and Utterlund? Prominent League citizens don't run farms - they live in the city and run businesses. If the Sand Fishers were League citizens, why would they be any different?		And that's a problem, because as Three Hands has repeatedly pointed out, there are precious few people in Holberg who want to live miles from the city, farming for a living. Most of the population of the territory is concentrated in the city, and moving to the city is the kind of dream that animates anyone with imagination and drive who doesn't already live there. Many older Sand Fishers still find the bustling streets of Holberg intimidating, but the younger members of the sept certainly don't. If the Sand Fishers become League citizens, why would they settle for farming lands in Rebeshof and Utterlund? Prominent League citizens don't run farms - they live in the city and run businesses. If the Sand Fishers were League citizens, why would they be any different?

	<quote by="Swift Fisher">...all the ~~Sandfishers~~ love Holberg and we don’t want anything bad to ever happen to it. We just want good things to happen to Holberg!</quote>		<quote by="Swift Fisher">...all the Sand Fishers love Holberg and we don’t want anything bad to ever happen to it. We just want good things to happen to Holberg!</quote>

	But if the Sand Fishers don't farm the land who will? This issue seems to genuinely animate the Sand Fishers - they're concerned that their friends and allies in Holberg have spent a prince's fortune arranging to drain the marshes to turn them into farmland and now there is going to be nobody to farm the land. They hate the thought of all that food going uneaten - they don't want the the city of Holberg to miss out on anything. The sept joining the Empire makes the problem of who will farm the outlying parts of the territory worse - not better - and that's a deep concern for them.		But if the Sand Fishers don't farm the land who will? This issue seems to genuinely animate the Sand Fishers - they're concerned that their friends and allies in Holberg have spent a prince's fortune arranging to drain the marshes to turn them into farmland and now there is going to be nobody to farm the land. They hate the thought of all that food going uneaten - they don't want the the city of Holberg to miss out on anything. The sept joining the Empire makes the problem of who will farm the outlying parts of the territory worse - not better - and that's a deep concern for them.

Hailmur: /* Paradise */

2026-08-27T14:05:47Z

Paradise

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	===Paradise===		===Paradise===
	* '''The Sand Fishers are deeply reluctant to give up ownership of their own lands and the right to rule themselves'''		* '''The Sand Fishers are deeply reluctant to give up ownership of their own lands and the right to rule themselves'''
	Almost every Sand Fisher alive today ~~that~~ is over the age of ten has lived the majority of their life under the mind-numbing cruelty of the Druj. When they dwelled in Ossium, the Sand Fishers were subject to unbelievably callous brutality on a day-to-day basis, expressly intended to break their spirit. The Empire freed them from that horror, giving them new lands to dwell in, away from the homeland of the Druj. The Sand Fishers are deeply grateful to the Empire for freeing them from the Druj rule, but the very cause of that gratitude, the precious freedom they have gained, is the same thing that makes it difficult for them to accept the offer to join the League.		Almost every Sand Fisher alive today who is over the age of ten has lived the majority of their life under the mind-numbing cruelty of the Druj. When they dwelled in Ossium, the Sand Fishers were subject to unbelievably callous brutality on a day-to-day basis, expressly intended to break their spirit. The Empire freed them from that horror, giving them new lands to dwell in, away from the homeland of the Druj. The Sand Fishers are deeply grateful to the Empire for freeing them from the Druj rule, but the very cause of that gratitude, the precious freedom they have gained, is the same thing that makes it difficult for them to accept the offer to join the League.

	The sept like having their own laws, their own leadership, and most especially their own lands. They speak of Misericorde with something akin to awe - they're aware that most Holbergers consider it to be a fairly worthless strip of coastline, but to them it's akin to ~~the promised land~~. It's not hard to eulogise a land of plenty, overflowing with food and drink, and safe from all threats, when you and your people have suffered hunger and deprivation for decades under the brutal rule of the Druj. It is hard for them to see joining the Empire as anything other than giving up that paradise.		The sept like having their own laws, their own leadership, and most especially their own lands. They speak of Misericorde with something akin to awe - they're aware that most Holbergers consider it to be a fairly worthless strip of coastline, but to them it's akin to a utopia. It's not hard to eulogise a land of plenty, overflowing with food and drink, and safe from all threats, when you and your people have suffered hunger and deprivation for decades under the brutal rule of the Druj. It is hard for them to see joining the Empire as anything other than giving up that paradise.

	And while Three Hands and the other elders might still lead the sept, they know that if they join the Empire they won't be making their own rules, they won't govern themselves. The younger Sand Fishers have studied civics in school, they know that anyone with a business will get a vote in the Holberg senatorial elections, if they attend Anvil. But only one Sand Fisher with a business has ever made that long journey, so the reality for them is that they'll be led by a senator they only met once and that briefly, and subject to the laws of a Senate they've never even seen.		And while Three Hands and the other elders might still lead the sept, they know that if they join the Empire they won't be making their own rules; they won't govern themselves. The younger Sand Fishers have studied civics in school; they know that anyone with a business will get a vote in the Holberg senatorial elections if they attend Anvil. But only one Sand Fisher with a business has ever made that long journey, so the reality for them is that they'll be led by a senator they only met once and that briefly, and subject to the laws of a Senate they've never even seen.

	They're Proud of the fact that they rule themselves now. They're not foolish enough to imagine that they could ever have thrown off the tyranny of the Druj by themselves - they know that self-rule was a gift given to them by the Empire. But they've embraced that gift and taken it into their hearts - persuading them to give it up is not easy. Not at the moment at least.		They're Proud of the fact that they rule themselves now. They're not foolish enough to imagine that they could ever have thrown off the tyranny of the Druj by themselves - they know that self-rule was a gift given to them by the Empire. But they've embraced that gift and taken it into their hearts - persuading them to give it up is not easy. Not at the moment, at least.

	<quote by="Three Hands">We’re not ready to live on Imperial lands. The young ones are – they don’t know any different. They don’t remember what it is like to live under a tyrant. But I remember. My sept remembers. We’re just not ready to live under someone else's laws, not yet. You gave us Misericorde so that we could rule ourselves. That is precious to us – unbelievably precious. We are not yet ready to return this gift you gave us.</quote>		<quote by="Three Hands">We’re not ready to live on Imperial lands. The young ones are – they don’t know any different. They don’t remember what it is like to live under a tyrant. But I remember. My sept remembers. We’re just not ready to live under someone else's laws, not yet. You gave us Misericorde so that we could rule ourselves. That is precious to us – unbelievably precious. We are not yet ready to return this gift you gave us.</quote>

	The Empire could just wait for this problem to go away. The Sand Fishers are a young growing sept, and within two generations, twenty years at most, this problem will be completely gone. Sand Fishers like Swift Fisher and Fleeting Grin would join the League in a heartbeat - but for the fact that they won't leave their sept. Once people like Swift Fisher and her peers are in the majority then it's almost inevitable that the sept will embrace the Empire, but that day is still a long way off.		The Empire could just wait for this problem to go away. The Sand Fishers are a young growing sept, and within two generations, twenty years at most, this problem will be completely gone. Sand Fishers like Swift Fisher and Fleeting Grin would join the League in a heartbeat - but for the fact that they won't leave their sept. Once people like Swift Fisher and her peers are in the majority, then it's almost inevitable that the sept will embrace the Empire, but that day is still a long way off.

	===Prudence===		===Prudence===

GuiltyConscience: /* Bunds */

2026-08-27T14:05:32Z

Bunds

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:05, 27 August 2026
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	* '''The League does not have anyone who wants to farm these lands'''		* '''The League does not have anyone who wants to farm these lands'''

	A few years ago, the late Professor Immanuel Gelberg was called on to appraise the Prosperity of Holberg. As part of his work he proposed the construction of a series of dykes to drain the wetlands of Holberg. Once complete, they would slowly drain the marshes, turning them into fertile farmland. [[Construct_Adelaarskade\|Work began on the Adelaarskade]] after the Autumn Equinox 387YE and it [[Holberg#Adelaarskade\|was quickly completed]]. As a result, the wetlands of [[#Rebeshof\|Rebeshof]] and [[#Utterlund\|Utterlund]] will be slowly drained, and, assuming nothing else changes, the regions will lose the [[Region_qualities#Marsh\|marsh]] quality by the start of the Spring Equinox 389YE.		A few years ago, the late Professor Immanuel Gelberg was called on to appraise the Prosperity of Holberg. As part of his work he proposed the construction of a series of dykes to drain the wetlands of Holberg. Once complete, they would slowly drain the marshes, turning them into fertile farmland. [[Construct_Adelaarskade\|Work began on the Adelaarskade]] after the Autumn Equinox 387YE and it [[Holberg#Adelaarskade\|was quickly completed]]. As a result, the wetlands of [[Holberg#Rebeshof\|Rebeshof]] and [[Holberg#Utterlund\|Utterlund]] will be slowly drained, and, assuming nothing else changes, the regions will lose the [[Region_qualities#Marsh\|marsh]] quality by the start of the Spring Equinox 389YE.

	The Sand Fishers are deeply concerned about this development. As they understand it, the plan relies on members of the sept settling in these new lands, where they will live as foreigners (or citizens if they join the Empire) and farm the land. That will produce wealth for the Sand Fishers and food for Holberg - they can see the advantages, but there are two distinct problems.		The Sand Fishers are deeply concerned about this development. As they understand it, the plan relies on members of the sept settling in these new lands, where they will live as foreigners (or citizens if they join the Empire) and farm the land. That will produce wealth for the Sand Fishers and food for Holberg - they can see the advantages, but there are two distinct problems.

GuiltyConscience: /* Bunds */

2026-08-27T14:04:15Z

Bunds

← Older revision		Revision as of 14:04, 27 August 2026
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	* '''The League does not have anyone who wants to farm these lands'''		* '''The League does not have anyone who wants to farm these lands'''

	A few years ago, the late Professor Immanuel Gelberg was called on to appraise the Prosperity of Holberg. As part of his work he proposed the construction of a series of dykes to drain the wetlands of Holberg. Once complete, they would slowly drain the marshes, turning them into fertile farmland. [[Construct_Adelaarskade\|Work began on the Adelaarskade]] after the Autumn Equinox 387YE and it [[Holberg#Adelaarskade\|was quickly completed]]. As a result, the wetlands of [[#Rebeshof\|Rebeshof]] and [[#Utterlund\|Utterlund]] will be slowly drained, and, assuming nothing else changes, the regions will lose [[Region_qualities#Marsh\|marsh]] quality by the start of the Spring Equinox 389YE.		A few years ago, the late Professor Immanuel Gelberg was called on to appraise the Prosperity of Holberg. As part of his work he proposed the construction of a series of dykes to drain the wetlands of Holberg. Once complete, they would slowly drain the marshes, turning them into fertile farmland. [[Construct_Adelaarskade\|Work began on the Adelaarskade]] after the Autumn Equinox 387YE and it [[Holberg#Adelaarskade\|was quickly completed]]. As a result, the wetlands of [[#Rebeshof\|Rebeshof]] and [[#Utterlund\|Utterlund]] will be slowly drained, and, assuming nothing else changes, the regions will lose the [[Region_qualities#Marsh\|marsh]] quality by the start of the Spring Equinox 389YE.

	The Sand Fishers are deeply concerned about this development. As they understand it, the plan relies on members of the sept settling in these new lands, where they will live as foreigners (or citizens if they join the Empire) and farm the land. That will produce wealth for the Sand Fishers and food for Holberg - they can see the advantages, but there are two distinct problems.		The Sand Fishers are deeply concerned about this development. As they understand it, the plan relies on members of the sept settling in these new lands, where they will live as foreigners (or citizens if they join the Empire) and farm the land. That will produce wealth for the Sand Fishers and food for Holberg - they can see the advantages, but there are two distinct problems.

GuiltyConscience: /* Sticking Points */

2026-08-27T13:52:13Z

Sticking Points

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:52, 27 August 2026
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	* '''There are four key sticking points preventing the Sand Fishers from joining the Empire'''		* '''There are four key sticking points preventing the Sand Fishers from joining the Empire'''

	Despite everything the Empire have done for them, there are a number of sticking points holding the Sand Fishers back from joining the Empire. They are reluctant to talk ~~abpit~~ them, but the merchant princes visiting Misericorde are persuasive and used to getting their own way. Eventually the orcs are convinced to talk openly about the prospect of becoming part of the Empire.		Despite everything the Empire have done for them, there are a number of sticking points holding the Sand Fishers back from joining the Empire. They are reluctant to talk aboit them, but the merchant princes visiting Misericorde are persuasive and used to getting their own way. Eventually the orcs are convinced to talk openly about the prospect of becoming part of the Empire.

	===Paradise===		===Paradise===

GuiltyConscience: /* Overview */

2026-08-27T13:50:12Z

Overview

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:50, 27 August 2026
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	The League Assembly overwhelmingly backed the judgement of '''Lia Adelaar von Holberg''' urging the [[Merchant Prince\|Princes]] of the League to reach out to the [[Holberg#Misericorde\|Sand Fishers]]. The [[Prosperity\|Prosperous]] sept of orcs were given the region of [[Holberg#Misericorde\|Misericorde]] as their own lands in Spring 383YE - since then the relationship has only grown stronger. Now the Princes of the League are aiming to see what might be done to persuade the sept to join the Empire; who better to persuade the orcs of the benefits of a seat at the great game?		The League Assembly overwhelmingly backed the judgement of '''Lia Adelaar von Holberg''' urging the [[Merchant Prince\|Princes]] of the League to reach out to the [[Holberg#Misericorde\|Sand Fishers]]. The [[Prosperity\|Prosperous]] sept of orcs were given the region of [[Holberg#Misericorde\|Misericorde]] as their own lands in Spring 383YE - since then the relationship has only grown stronger. Now the Princes of the League are aiming to see what might be done to persuade the sept to join the Empire; who better to persuade the orcs of the benefits of a seat at the great game?

	Ultimately, the egregore decides who can or cannot join a nation - the nature of the bond is that it can only be formed with someone an ~~egregores~~ recognises as having the potential to be a member of the nation. But the League has already embraced the Apulian Orcs, why not the Holberg Orcs as well? Either way, the Empire can benefit by holding their allies close.		Ultimately, the egregore decides who can or cannot join a nation - the nature of the bond is that it can only be formed with someone an egregore recognises as having the potential to be a member of the nation. But the League has already embraced the Apulian Orcs, why not the Holberg Orcs as well? Either way, the Empire can benefit by holding their allies close.

	==Virtuous Friends==		==Virtuous Friends==
	<div style="float:right; width: 200px; clear: left;">		<div style="float:right; width: 200px; clear: left;">

GuiltyConscience at 13:49, 27 August 2026

2026-08-27T13:49:14Z

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:49, 27 August 2026
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	Albet van Temeschwar watched the young orc conduct the lesson with a dedication to her charges that would have made any priest of the Little Mother proud. Swift Fisher might be young, but like many Summer Children, she was impossibly tall and surprisingly mature for her age. Even so, it was a peculiar scene, the young orc stood in front of an antique looking blackboard on a heavy wooden frame, as half a dozen adult members of the sept struggled to copy their letters.		Albet van Temeschwar watched the young orc conduct the lesson with a dedication to her charges that would have made any priest of the Little Mother proud. Swift Fisher might be young, but like many Summer Children, she was impossibly tall and surprisingly mature for her age. Even so, it was a peculiar scene, the young orc stood in front of an antique looking blackboard on a heavy wooden frame, as half a dozen adult members of the sept struggled to copy their letters.

	In many ways the whole thing epitomised the Sand Fishers. The young members of the sept were packed off to Holberg to study in the schools (and lately the university) alongside the children of Holberg's wealthy families. But as soon as school was out, they had to hurry home where they were expected to devote every hour to teaching what they knew to the older members of the sept before they headed back to the city. ~~Alsbet~~ couldn't remember the last time he'd spoken with someone so dedicated. When he'd asked Swift Fisher where she'd got the black board from, she'd explained that her school had been throwing it out, so she and a fellow student had lugged the rickety old thing all the way back to Misericorde ~~betweeen~~ them.		In many ways the whole thing epitomised the Sand Fishers. The young members of the sept were packed off to Holberg to study in the schools (and lately the university) alongside the children of Holberg's wealthy families. But as soon as school was out, they had to hurry home where they were expected to devote every hour to teaching what they knew to the older members of the sept before they headed back to the city. Albet couldn't remember the last time he'd spoken with someone so dedicated. When he'd asked Swift Fisher where she'd got the black board from, she'd explained that her school had been throwing it out, so she and a fellow student had lugged the rickety old thing all the way back to Misericorde between them.

	He smiled to himself as a ~~humerous~~ notion occurred to him. "We can't possibly let them join the League" he whispered to Verah, "they work too hard... they'll make the rest of us look bad!" His fellow prince stifled a laugh, to avoid disturbing the lesson.		He smiled to himself as a humorous notion occurred to him. "We can't possibly let them join the League" he whispered to Verah, "they work too hard... they'll make the rest of us look bad!" His fellow prince stifled a laugh, to avoid disturbing the lesson.

	She shook her head as if to disagree with him. "It'll be fine," she explained, "a few hours in the company of Harlequin and he'll teach them "enjoying the fruits" is the whole point of all that labour."		She shook her head as if to disagree with him. "It'll be fine," she explained, "a few hours in the company of Harlequin and he'll teach them "enjoying the fruits" is the whole point of all that labour."

	Albet smiled but something about the exchange struck him as significant. He'd jumped at the chance to come to Misericorde when Lia Adelaar had asked the merchant princes to find a way to persuade the orcs to join the League. He'd told himself it was the opportunity for new customers, and ~~mabe~~ even the prospect of finding new members for his carta, but mostly he'd just been curious for a chance to meet the famous Holberg Orcs. Now he had, it was easy to see why everyone seemed to like the Sand Fishers. They were as affable as they were earnest. ~~Enthuasistic~~ supporters of Holberg and the League, they were honest and hard-working in equal measures.		Albet smiled but something about the exchange struck him as significant. He'd jumped at the chance to come to Misericorde when Lia Adelaar had asked the merchant princes to find a way to persuade the orcs to join the League. He'd told himself it was the opportunity for new customers, and maybe even the prospect of finding new members for his carta, but mostly he'd just been curious for a chance to meet the famous Holberg Orcs. Now he had, it was easy to see why everyone seemed to like the Sand Fishers. They were as affable as they were earnest. Enthusiastic supporters of Holberg and the League, they were honest and hard-working in equal measures.

	It raised the rather obvious question of why anyone would want to change that. Albet and the other merchant princes had all been briefed on what they were here to do, but suddenly he was struck by the fact that he didn't know ''why'' he was here at all. To persuade the Sand Fishers to join the Empire of course, but why? Was all this for their benefit... or the Empires?		It raised the rather obvious question of why anyone would want to change that. Albet and the other merchant princes had all been briefed on what they were here to do, but suddenly he was struck by the fact that he didn't know ''why'' he was here at all. To persuade the Sand Fishers to join the Empire of course, but why? Was all this for their benefit... or the Empires?

Twiggy: /* Further Reading */

2026-08-27T13:42:36Z

Rafferty: Created page with "Category:Winds of FortuneCategory:388YE AutumnCategory:Highest Calling Albet van Temeschwar watched the young orc conduct the lesson with a dedication to her charges that would have made any priest of the Little Mother proud. Swift Fisher might be young, but like many Summer Children, she was impossibly tall and surprisingly mature for her age. Even so, it was a peculiar scene, the young orc stood in front of an antique looking blackboard on a heavy wood..."

2026-08-27T13:37:49Z

Created page with "Category:Winds of Fortune Category:388YE Autumn Category:Highest Calling <ic> Albet van Temeschwar watched the young orc conduct the lesson with a dedication to her charges that would have made any priest of the Little Mother proud. Swift Fisher might be young, but like many Summer Children, she was impossibly tall and surprisingly mature for her age. Even so, it was a peculiar scene, the young orc stood in front of an antique looking blackboard on a heavy wood..."

Show changes

← Older revision		Revision as of 16:23, 27 August 2026
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	* [[Any dream will do]] - 388YE Summer wind of fortune discussing the League highest calling		* [[Any dream will do]] - 388YE Summer wind of fortune discussing the League highest calling
	* [[The highest calling]] - 387YE Autumn wind of fortune introducing the highest calling		* [[The highest calling]] - 387YE Autumn wind of fortune introducing the highest calling
	* [[Any port in a storm#The Sand Fisher Contribution\|Any port in a storm]] - 387YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about an opportunity to give the Sand Fishers their own trade enclave
	* [[Threats that are to come#The Common Good\|Threats that are to come]] - 387YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about an opportunity to make the Sand Fishers more prosperous		{{Sandfisher Links}}
	* [[To see what you sell#Holberg\|To see what you sell]] - 384YE Spring Wind of Fortune about how they might repay the Empire for its aid
	* [[Across the Abyss]] - 383YE Winter Wind of Fortune about the Sand Fishers philosophy and ways to aid them
	* [[The blessing way#Sand Fishers\|The blessing way]] - 383YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about Druj threats to the Sand Fishers
	* [[A dream that can last]] - 383YE Summer Wind of Fortune following the relocation of the Sand Fishers
	* [[A strange land#The Sand Fishers\|A strange land]] - 383YE Spring Wind of Fortune about the possible relocation of the Sand Fishers

← Older revision		Revision as of 13:42, 27 August 2026
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	* [[Any dream will do]] - 388YE Summer wind of fortune discussing the League highest calling		* [[Any dream will do]] - 388YE Summer wind of fortune discussing the League highest calling
	* [[The highest calling]] - 387YE Autumn wind of fortune introducing the highest calling		* [[The highest calling]] - 387YE Autumn wind of fortune introducing the highest calling
			* [[Any port in a storm#The Sand Fisher Contribution\|Any port in a storm]] - 387YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about an opportunity to give the Sand Fishers their own trade enclave
			* [[Threats that are to come#The Common Good\|Threats that are to come]] - 387YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about an opportunity to make the Sand Fishers more prosperous
			* [[To see what you sell#Holberg\|To see what you sell]] - 384YE Spring Wind of Fortune about how they might repay the Empire for its aid
			* [[Across the Abyss]] - 383YE Winter Wind of Fortune about the Sand Fishers philosophy and ways to aid them
			* [[The blessing way#Sand Fishers\|The blessing way]] - 383YE Autumn Wind of Fortune about Druj threats to the Sand Fishers
			* [[A dream that can last]] - 383YE Summer Wind of Fortune following the relocation of the Sand Fishers
			* [[A strange land#The Sand Fishers\|A strange land]] - 383YE Spring Wind of Fortune about the possible relocation of the Sand Fishers